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wprov
United Kingdom
15 Posts |
 Posted - 16 Aug 2012 : 12:15:03
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Hi all,
Well I have seen "Easy-Pc" grow from dos to wineasypc upwards !. Easy-Pc was the main application along with digital & analogue spice simulators as well as Layan. All to go to waste as time went on so did the investment !.
Yes there is coperate version but paying for a "upgrade" still implies some sort of end user involvment with the developing application !. Yes there will be features that come close to Pulsonix but that will happen. Westdev will "pinch" ideas to "add" value. But still no excuse not to improve Easy-Pc !.
I have been trying to get a feature incoperated for so long which although in a more special area would have benifit to all (depending upon point of prospective) which would be considered basics i.e. all cad apps should be able to do !.
Thus trying to find a way to overcome the resistance of Westdev for a useful feature rather than what has been introduced over time !.
If a voting method will get it done then all the better. If not then at least why not say rather than waiting till a "broken" release to find again no feature added.
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Hanspeter
14 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2012 : 12:47:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Peter Johnson
This message is speaking personally, not as a representative of Westdev.
I think I have to take some responsibility for the absence of G-code as a feature. There have been a few requests for this during the year, but I must stress that it has only been a few, and other issues have been more prominent. The requests were logged in the usual way, but when I was asked to comment on a list of possible new features, I didn't spot the absence of a G-code output, and to be honest, given the low level of requests, probably wouldn't have put it forward anyway. Equally, I don't recall a single request for STEP code until after V16 had been released.
This does highlight the importance of asking for features you want to see. It doesn't guarantee the inclusion, but if a lot of users are asking, it really does significantly increase the likelihood of a feature being implemented. Commenting afterwards about missing features does make the development team aware of them, but by then it's too late, and introduces a year's delay.
Dear Mr. Johnson,
I personally LOVE you for haven the B@*?s no, I mean squares
to respond on sensitive post such as 'Version WISH LIST'.
As I posted somewhere on a topic, Do please please for goodness
and sanity sake, WestDev must draw a topic specifically for
EasyPC users WISH LIST so we are on same future development
road map, as part of 45,000 registered users worldwide we are
stake holders in EasyPC! and DEMAND a say in it's upgrades.
This "exciting new features" that your marketing team puts out
are just too Colourful and pointless.
Look let's face it, 'You' at WestDev wants us 'Users' to roll along
with 'Your' new version release meant for 'Us' and some Dissatisfied
or New CAD hopefuls elsewhere, don't you think the tailor ought
to pay attention to the wearer?
See, I don't understand all the big CAD jargon, technical terms
used on this fora, all I want is a functional, Low-cost, WishList Topic
and above all a working EasyPC, so I can meet my contractual
obligation towards my clients.
Functionality in an arm-chair is what we want, all in pursuant to humans gradually losing it's ability to walk.
Kind regards,
Hanspeter Baer.
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Edited by - Hanspeter on 17 Aug 2012 07:58:15 |
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johnt
United Kingdom
52 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2012 : 13:35:16
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I made my comments in private but
I am now trialing Eagle and considering Altium.
I see the problem as the company not the product
so I wont even consider designspark.
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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2012 : 15:44:44
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Johnt,
I think we would all be interested in what your findings and conclusions are after
you trial Eagle and Altium in comparison to Easypc.
Iain |
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toni9999
United Kingdom
39 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2012 : 16:24:09
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I would also be interested my only concern is creating all my companies library items again.
Lots of room for error in that process.
T |
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hodali
Germany
148 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2012 : 16:39:18
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TINA Design Suite 9.3 looks interesting. It is a powerful yet affordable circuit simulation and PCB design software package for analyzing, designing, and real time testing of analog, digital, VHDL, MCU, and mixed electronic circuits and their PCB layouts.
You can also analyze SMPS, RF, communication, and optoelectronic circuits; generate and debug MCU code using the integrated flowchart tool; and test microcontroller applications in a mixed circuit environment. A unique feature of TINA is that you can bring your circuit to life with the optional USB controlled TINALab II and LogiXplorer hardware, which turns your computer into a powerful, multifunction T&M instrument. Electrical engineers will find TINA an easy to use, high performance tool, while educators will welcome its unique features for the training environment.
There are some videos on the internet:
http://youtu.be/GQF5cLxdBpI
TINA 9.3 - Design Suite Industrial version costs only 1200 Euro. You can download a demo version on http://www.tina.com |
Edited by - hodali on 01 Sep 2012 12:00:22 |
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hodali
Germany
148 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2012 : 15:46:41
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| I tested TINA Design Suite 9.3. LTspice is better than TINA Design Suite 9.3. However TINA Design Suite 9.3 supports multi-core processors and is very fast. It is the fastest spice simulation tool on the market. The PCB editor is less powerful than EasyPC. But Easy-PC doesn't have an integrated spice simulator. |
Edited by - hodali on 03 Sep 2012 18:28:12 |
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johnt
United Kingdom
52 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 15:22:39
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Yes Iain - I'll try and make a few comments as I go if I get time.
I'm starting a new product that will take me until at least
XMAS to do - I've had a look at the free release of Eagle and
think it should be achievable on that or maybe with a small add on so I'll give it a go.
Depending on how things work out I'll then look at Altium.
This is all very dissapointing because I do like easyPC and did
choose it after looking around initially.
Toni - yes libraries are the big issue. Its for that reason
I'm looking outside of anything westDev do. This is a product that requires long term trust and support.
Initial thoughts without full explanations:
EasyPC - Ease of (interface) use 9/10
Libraries 2/10
Router 5/10
Commercial usability 4/10
3D features 4/10
Eagle - Ease of use 7/10
Libraries 8/10
Router 8/10
Commercial usability 9/10
3D features 1/10
This ignores most features but picks up the core idea I think.
You may want to add things like plotting, BOM features, script language etc but I dont know enough about Eagle yet to say too much more. Most essential electrical and simulation features will probably be similar with very minor variations in all I expect.
(both need to copper pour, both need to back annotate etc. )
(Negative points to Eagle for a back annotation trap by the way)
Just one comment on Eagle ease of use: Everyone complains about the old fashion interface - I give marks for that because
1: I'm pretty old myself and have used the style before
2: It really isnt that big a deal - just a different way to click
EasyPC feels nicer though in that respect - you cant get away from that.
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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 15:56:36
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I too chose EasyPC after reviewing other packages many years ago. I also have to say that in the light of the recent negativity of the product, I still think that it is absolutely terrific. The main bone of contention from me has always been the library structure. However because the product does what I want from a professional point of view, I am prepared to live with it. In EasyPC's defense, I think everybody complains about the things they don't like and forget about all the features that are very useful and work very well. Sometimes you can find features that you have not used before to find them excellent. I have just used the net match feature on a 12 layer board, and discovered that this is a fantastic and powerful feature.
JohnT you give the router a low score, but the prorouter is excellent...... but at the risk of starting the autoroute debate again, I don't use it even though I bought it, a I have discovered there is no better professional way to lay out a pcb but manually.
EasyPC is a professional quality product, I have done literally many hundreds of boards over 10 years or so, and have never regretted my purchase. The feature list is now saturated and thats the problem when they upgrade, the library structure could be a lot better and I would like to see features to ease high speed layouts.
Also the fact you have telephone support, which may I say has been excellent from my own experiances, and you get all this for a 50 Quit upgrade for a year is exceptional.
Every product will have its critics but at the end of the day its a personal opinion and nobody is being forced to use a tool if they don't like it. There are other packages so the choice is there.
Iain
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n/a
41 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 10:31:03
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Well I have a V16 disk in my drawer, but after having read this thread I can't decide now whether to send it back for a refund or use it as an expensive coffee mat.
All I asked for in a previous thread was for the BMP importing tool to be made to work in some kind of sensible fashion so I could put our company logo on the silk screen, but it's probably not even been looked at and I'm certainly not going to risk a new installation just to see.
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hodali
Germany
148 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 10:40:34
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HRPeteG , you can create your logo and save it as a DXF file. Easy-PC is able to import DXF files. If you don't have a mechanical cad system you can use a converter. So it is not necessary to import BMP files.
Number one should be focused on more advanced features like high speed PCB design, full backwards ECO where the PCB is considered the 'master' and the schematic is updated to match and so on...
quote:
Originally posted by HRPeteG
Well I have a V16 disk in my drawer, but after having read this thread I can't decide now whether to send it back for a refund or use it as an expensive coffee mat.
All I asked for in a previous thread was for the BMP importing tool to be made to work in some kind of sensible fashion so I could put our company logo on the silk screen, but it's probably not even been looked at and I'm certainly not going to risk a new installation just to see.
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Edited by - hodali on 04 Sep 2012 10:54:59 |
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n/a
41 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 11:06:52
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hodali
I'm aware of that, my point was that since the function is there, it should work and people shouldn't have to involve another package (which they may not have) to convert it.
High speed design is an extremely complex thing to implement correctly and reliably, importing bmps is not. I don't want to harp on about this, it was simply another example of user requests being ignored. I wasn't asking them to add a whole new function, I was just asking them to make one that's already there work. |
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johnt
United Kingdom
52 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 12:14:30
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Iain - sure you are right no doubt. I'm just pretty convinced easyPC is now a dead duck as far as further real development is concerned and I don't trust the way that is being handled.
I'd be pleased to be proved wrong.
Also I look around and see other things - like support for products
like Eagle from other third parties - for example yesterday
I downloaded component layout data from Microchip. This
was available for eagle and a whole slew of other products - but not for easyPC. Components libraries as you probably know better than me are a key resource. Manufacturers support of that type makes a massive difference and time saving.
westDev must know this - and their solution is to ignore it.
Similarly with manufacturing support - eagle now has active
support from eurocircuits. By active I mean active. Now I havn't used eurocircuits so I dont know if they are good bad or indifferent but I have met them at trade shows and they seem pretty much the up and coming manufacturer to me. Their entire approach is superbly professional.
Where is westDevs response to this sort of third part activity?
I dont seen any indication they even care.
These are the things today that differentiate box shifters from corporate partners - which is what they should be IMHO.
The product is good but thats not enough anymore. Ongoing activity is vital.
I think we've talked about routers before so I'll just say the reason eagle won some points in my book is their free version
seems at least as capable as the one I paid money for to use with
easyPC- if not better in some respects.
Incidently - eagle got 1 point for 3D graphics simply because
a hobbyist somewhere has made it work with POVray
(I used V1.0 of POVray so was amused by that)
More than I planned to say but I think the point I wanted to make should be clear anyway.
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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 19:33:01
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Johnt ... I agree with your library comments, as you probably know its structure has always been my bug-bear, however you are also correct about third party integration with this. I don't know why some if the third party people like Ultra Librarian have heard of Eagle and Designspark, but have never heard of EasyPC.
Like yourself this does make me feel un-easy for the future. My only relief (rightly or wrongly) is that if EasyPC disappears hopefully Pulsonix will still be around and I could jump onto that (at a cost of course).
Direct Manufacturing support is not an issue I don't think, in fact its a bad thing that kinda leads to using one specified manufacturer. We never do that, all designs are submitted for best quotes and turnaround etc. Emailing your files for quotation/manufacture is no big deal.
I have no interest in simulation, so as far as I am concerned apart from high speed tools EasyPC does all it really needs to do and does it well. If the library structure could be refined then I would be a happy man. Of course you can import eagle libraries but its a bit clunky so I suppose refinements there would also help a bit.
My annoyance with Pulsonix is if I go that route I can still import design files and libraries from EasyPC and carry on business, however these new pulsonix files cannot be ported back to EasyPC ... a real nuisence as a lot of my customers also use EasyPC and thats how they want their files. Also Pulsonix being the big expensive daddy, why the hell will it not import Designspark ???? ...... all very badly thought out I think.
Iain
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hodali
Germany
148 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 07:56:31
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| When you make a complex design you need to simulate the circuit and the software. Mix-signal design includes FPGA, analog and digital components. At the moment Easy-PC comes without a VHDL simulator, microcontroller simulator and spice simulator. What is about Easy-spice ? Is there any Easy-Spice user here ? Can anybody share experience ? |
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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 08:26:59
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quote:
Originally posted by hodali
At the moment Easy-PC comes without a VHDL simulator, microcontroller simulator and spice simulator.
And thats because its a PCB layout package .... nothing else.
We never use simulation so it works fine for us. Simulation does not need to be an integrated part of a layout package.
Iain
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edrees
United Kingdom
779 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 09:13:38
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Hodali,
If you require an excellent Spice simulator for free, try LT spice from Linear Technology.
I don't buy a combined microwave, washing machine, dryer, Hoover, TV & video. I buy separate products which inevitably don't have inherent compromises,as you mention in one of your earlier posts. EasyPC as a schematic & pcb layout package is hard to beat, ..so is LT Spice. |
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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 13:26:48
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quote:
Originally posted by edrees
Hodali,
If you require an excellent Spice simulator for free, try LT spice from Linear Technology.
I don't buy a combined microwave, washing machine, dryer, Hoover, TV & video. I buy separate products which inevitably don't have inherent compromises,as you mention in one of your earlier posts. EasyPC as a schematic & pcb layout package is hard to beat, ..so is LT Spice.
Ed .... I wish I could think up answers like that  |
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hodali
Germany
148 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 16:09:24
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I use LTspice for measuring pulses and conducted interference emission (EMC) and it is very good apart from it is slow. My computer has 16 cores, but LTspice use only one core.
I also use Tina TI which is much faster, because it uses most cores (free og charge).
Easy-PC doesn't have spice models for the sold components (Connector Library 3. Microcontroller Library) .
By the way how do you export your schematic to LTspice and import back to Easy-PC? Or do you redraw the schematic ? There is more room for errors, Iain Wilkie and edrees !!!
quote:
Originally posted by edrees
Hodali,
If you require an excellent Spice simulator for free, try LT spice from Linear Technology.
I don't buy a combined microwave, washing machine, dryer, Hoover, TV & video. I buy separate products which inevitably don't have inherent compromises,as you mention in one of your earlier posts. EasyPC as a schematic & pcb layout package is hard to beat, ..so is LT Spice.
Daniel Hodali |
Edited by - hodali on 05 Sep 2012 16:47:15 |
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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 20:43:43
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[quote]Originally posted by hodali
By the way how do you export your schematic to LTspice and import back to Easy-PC? Or do you redraw the schematic ? There is more room for errors, Iain Wilkie and edrees !!!
Well I have already said ...... I do not use simulators !!!
Iain |
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remi
United Kingdom
101 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2012 : 10:29:15
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| if you want a CAD software that is good with simulator go with Proteus or Altium. Those packages are way better than EasyPC in every aspect and they include a stable simulator and massive libraries of "simulable" components |
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hodali
Germany
148 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2012 : 21:48:10
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| Thanks remi. I decided to buy Allegro. It is better than all mentioned packages. We will keep Easy-PC for our apprentices. Easy-PC is easy to use, but is unsuitable for professional work. |
Edited by - hodali on 09 Sep 2012 21:51:53 |
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Scazon
United Kingdom
66 Posts |
Posted - 12 Oct 2012 : 16:19:39
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| Finally got round to installing V16 on computer... well I know you've not supported W2000 for a few years, but finally it won't install. I'll stick to V15 until I get round to updating the OS. There's far too much on Old Faithful for me to want to change computers... |
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Topic |
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Release of V16