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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Aug 2020 : 08:38:02
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Well folks whats your verdict/thoughts ?
The emphasis this year as stated by the developers is making EPC work smarter for you, by adding features that customers have fed back.
And I have to say in that respect ... one that I proposed (to be able to zip up all the project files in a click) has been implemented and I have used it and it works great.
However thats where all my excitement ends.
There is no doubt that some of the new features will resonate with some users, to an old dinosaur like myself that has EPC ingrained into my very sole for over 20 years there is nothing new that couldn't be done before, and so I think I will be sticking to my normal methodology which is so automatic now it would be difficult for me to change.
Having said that, I do understand that the tool features are quite saturated now and its going to be difficult for the developers to pull something out of the bag, but why there is still not a more automated way of creating high speed track routing (differential pairs etc) especially these days beats me.
High speed routing is practically a pre-requisite of any pcb tool these days so to continue to have to do this manually is my only gripe.
So why upgrade I hear you ask ..... well lets not forget that for a measly £69.00 you get another year of exceptional support that beats all the others hands down and to me that is the jewel in the crown of Numberone Systems.
Iain |
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edrees
United Kingdom
779 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2020 : 11:47:45
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As another old Dinosaur, I too find the new "features" underwhelming. Nothing that could have been done "in the old way". So I too find it difficult to change my methodology.
I have no issue with paying £69 for another year of excellent support from Number One, -my main concern is whether V24 will be less compatible with Win7/64 Pro machines? V23 runs perfectly fine on Win7/64 Pro, but the latest "Systems Requirement" for V24 is less than clear regarding support and compatibility for Win7.
"Windows7. Easy-PC supported until at least June 2017. We no longer directly support Easy-PC on earlier versions of Windows, although you may still find that the application operates perfectly well on those versions."
I don't want to buy a new PC (with Win10!) just for EasyPC, that makes it a very expensive upgrade, -especially if/when your V23 files have just been re-saved in (non-backwards compatible) V24 format and you subsequently find that V24 fails to run properly under Win7/64 Pro.
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shadders
United Kingdom
224 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2020 : 16:32:03
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Hi,
I always upgrade whatever the new version - as it is rather cheap for a hobbyist.
I use Linux as my OS of choice, and Play On Linux allows you to run Easy-PC with some issues, but in general, it works.
For any new features - i know that Easy-PC has a calculator for various PCB design requirements, but what may be beneficial is that each track based on the base settings (1.6mm FR4 PCB, copper thickness etc), that it automatically calculates the inductance or capacitance for each track.
This could be a call out, right hand mouse button click to invoke the calculation, or a report (details the track from component pin to component pin names - example). Average track width should be sufficient for a basic calculation, and no need for any specialist programming - just to get an idea of the inductance/capacitance scale.
This feature would save a lot of time, as using the inbuilt calculator would be cumbersome for many tracks.
Regards,
Shadders. |
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markpsu
USA
68 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2020 : 09:27:03
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| I would also love to see a differential pair routing feature! Other then that PCB layout is only part of my job so I tend to do things the manual way rather then spend time learning all the tools, so I typically don't use the new features anyway. However, as others have said it's relatively low cost while still being a professional package and with support. The upgrade's at a price where my boss doesn't question it, so that's always nice. |
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636steve
United Kingdom
14 Posts |
Posted - 14 Aug 2020 : 11:46:14
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As many have mentioned above I have used EasyPc for the last 20+ years and so have a workflow that is difficult to change, but not sure any of the new 'features' will be of much benefit.
The one thing I find really lacking in EasyPc now is 3d support. I find so many of my customers now have the 3d files of the enclosures the board needs to go in ( and some of them are odd shaped) that it would be so much easier to generate the board from an imported file.
Even being able to export the existing 3d view as a 3d file would help then that could be imported into a cad program.
I will still upgrade even though I may have to start looking elsewhere now to get the 3d support many of my customers are now demanding. |
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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
Posted - 14 Aug 2020 : 11:52:18
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636Steve
I believe the IDF export can go some way to solving this. Some of the cad guys I have worked with have just asked for these files and then they generate the 3D image they need.
Iain |
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Peter Johnson
United Kingdom
498 Posts |
Posted - 14 Aug 2020 : 15:11:49
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There is a consideration here that hasn't been mentioned. Easy-PC has a 'big brother' intended for the corporate market in the form of Pulsonix. Obviously as it's got a corporate level price tag, it's got quite a few extra features - a significantly higher level of configurability being only one of them. The problem is that it comes at a price, so to speak, so users of that version would get quite upset if Easy-PC started to approach the same functionality, so in effect there's a glaas ceiling on how far Easy-PC can go. Let's take the 3D mentioned earlier. Yes, you can add an optional extra to output IDF files to add support for 3D, but Pulsonix can import and export STEP files, so in this area it's more flexible. Similarly the autorouter in Pulsonix can zigzag tracks for impedance matching, so you can get significantly more functionality - but there's (literally) a price to pay for it. Overall, Easy-PC probably has a good balance of advanced functionality with ease of use, though the learning curve has progressively got steeper because of the demand for new features.
Incidentally, if you've got an odd board profile, you can always use the DXF import to get it into Easy-PC. If the DXF is disjointed, you may need to initially import it as a shape sothat the join shapes utility can complete the profile. Once it's a complete closed shape, you can convert it into a board. |
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toni9999
United Kingdom
39 Posts |
Posted - 14 Aug 2020 : 17:02:32
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| Unfortunately Pulsonix stops most of these "advanced" features ever making it into EasyPC. |
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shuttlem
United Kingdom
13 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2020 : 10:20:07
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It is unfortunate that Pulsonix acts as a vertical blockage to both differential routing and step model import as features in EasyPC, as horizontally, the competition for this level of package (I'm thinking Eagle, Circuitstudio, Kicad) all do offer both diff routing and step model import. I think it is naive to think that these features are the preserve of high end 'corporate' packages. Many projects, even of the home build variety, end up with differential signalling (eg USB, ethernet) and not offering this is beginning to look quite backwards.
High end packages (I get to use Altium at work every now and again) differentiate themsleves with far more advanced features - multiple layer stacks, flex-rigid, electro-magnetic, thermal and power network analysis, simulation built-in, etc, etc. Differential routing has become a pretty basic requirement as has step model import.
They don't need to be super fancy. You already have the tools for defining the net classes, if you'd just add some more useful information to the layer stack like dielectric constants and thicknesses to feed into the impedance calculator which in turn could create a net class to apply to a track pair which then need to hug as they route. You already have tools for reporting length matching, just add a manual serpentine creator bounded by a box and we can drag it to get the right lengths.
I know you have to maintain some differentiators between EasyPC and Pulsonix, but I really don't think diff routing, step import and step export are features that are out of the price range of EasyPC. Heck, I'd pay for them as a paid-for option. |
Edited by - shuttlem on 17 Aug 2020 10:25:13 |
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Iain Wilkie
United Kingdom
1015 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2020 : 10:38:19
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quote:
Originally posted by shuttlem
It is unfortunate that Pulsonix acts as a vertical blockage to both differential routing and step model import as features in EasyPC, as horizontally, the competition for this level of package (I'm thinking Eagle, Circuitstudio, Kicad) all do offer both diff routing and step model import. I think it is naive to think that these features are the preserve of high end 'corporate' packages. Many projects, even of the home build variety, end up with differential signalling (eg USB, ethernet) and not offering this is beginning to look quite backwards.
High end packages (I get to use Altium at work every now and again) differentiate themsleves with far more advanced features - multiple layer stacks, flex-rigid, electro-magnetic, thermal and power network analysis, simulation built-in, etc, etc. Differential routing has become a pretty basic requirement as has step model import.
They don't need to be super fancy. You already have the tools for defining the net classes, if you'd just add some more useful information to the layer stack like dielectric constants and thicknesses to feed into the impedance calculator which in turn could create a net class to apply to a track pair which then need to hug as they route. You already have tools for reporting length matching, just add a manual serpentine creator bounded by a box and we can drag it to get the right lengths.
I know you have to maintain some differentiators between EasyPC and Pulsonix, but I really don't think diff routing, step import and step export are features that are out of the price range of EasyPC. Heck, I'd pay for them as a paid-for option.
Well said and I couldn't agree more ..... diff routing is a fundamental requirement of any PCB layout package these days as I have always maintained in the past.
I think Numberone really need to address this issue.
Iain |
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jlawton
United Kingdom
108 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2020 : 14:04:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Iain Wilkie
quote:
Originally posted by shuttlem
It is unfortunate that Pulsonix acts as a vertical blockage to both differential routing and step model import as features in EasyPC, as horizontally, the competition for this level of package (I'm thinking Eagle, Circuitstudio, Kicad) all do offer both diff routing and step model import. I think it is naive to think that these features are the preserve of high end 'corporate' packages. Many projects, even of the home build variety, end up with differential signalling (eg USB, ethernet) and not offering this is beginning to look quite backwards.
High end packages (I get to use Altium at work every now and again) differentiate themsleves with far more advanced features - multiple layer stacks, flex-rigid, electro-magnetic, thermal and power network analysis, simulation built-in, etc, etc. Differential routing has become a pretty basic requirement as has step model import.
They don't need to be super fancy. You already have the tools for defining the net classes, if you'd just add some more useful information to the layer stack like dielectric constants and thicknesses to feed into the impedance calculator which in turn could create a net class to apply to a track pair which then need to hug as they route. You already have tools for reporting length matching, just add a manual serpentine creator bounded by a box and we can drag it to get the right lengths.
I know you have to maintain some differentiators between EasyPC and Pulsonix, but I really don't think diff routing, step import and step export are features that are out of the price range of EasyPC. Heck, I'd pay for them as a paid-for option.
Well said and I couldn't agree more ..... diff routing is a fundamental requirement of any PCB layout package these days as I have always maintained in the past.
I think Numberone really need to address this issue.
Iain
Pulsonix is nice but the price differential is significant, so I agree that a paid-for option in Easy-PC would be a good way forward for this.
John |
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V24